Languages in the Fate of the Norns universe

[andrew]

With the upcoming bestiary (http://www.fateofthenorns.com/img/Creat ... -FOTNR.pdf) we plan on adding a language system for the various realms upon Yggdrasil.

I'd like to start a discussion in terms of how to best structure them.

First are foremost, we try to be as faithful as possible to the history and myth, so I'm thinking about using the real languages used during the 10th century throughout the Viking lands. Secondly, I'm thinking about having a "common" language per realm (Muspellian, Asgardian, etc) and then potentially building out sub-systems by the monstrous races in those realms.

Thoughts? Anyone seen some really great language systems in other RPGs that are worth looking at?

[raleel]

I’m actually quite fond of how Champions/Hero does languages. They have families and the like, and you can understand some out of other languages if you have one in the family.

I tend not to use them. While I really like them, I really do, they are just hard to use I think.

[andrew]

I’m actually quite fond of how Champions/Hero does languages. They have families and the like, and you can understand some out of other languages if you have one in the family.

I tend not to use them. While I really like them, I really do, they are just hard to use I think.

I'm the same way, but occasionally it does come up. Can someone/something/another-species understand your MoR's goading and taunting? If your historical campaign takes you abroad and into the lands of foreign cultures. I've gone down that rabbit hole to see what 10th century regions of Europe were speaking.

I like idea of the main language having other languages almost as dialects. We could have realm languages being the top tier and then kingdom/region languages being a dialect.

The written languages of the Alfar have been a thing for a few years as I've been developing the War of Shadow. Same letters, same words, but different meanings between the Lios and the Svart. So to understand an inscription, you'd need to know who wrote it.

[raleel]

I'm the same way, but occasionally it does come up. Can someone/something/another-species understand your MoR's goading and taunting? If your historical campaign takes you abroad and into the lands of foreign cultures. I've gone down that rabbit hole to see what 10th century regions of Europe were speaking.

See, to me, the MoR abilities are "magical". They don't have to pay attention to language because if that is the case, it DRASTICALLY limits what they can do. They can't taunt wolves, for instance.

I think in one of the sagas (I forget which), someone wrestles a bear and iirc, taunts the bear in some fashion and the bear seems to understand. I mean, really, we are in the world of ghost seals poking their heads into your house, I feel like universal translator taunting is probably pretty tame

I like idea of the main language having other languages almost as dialects. We could have realm languages being the top tier and then kingdom/region languages being a dialect.

The written languages of the Alfar have been a thing for a few years as I've been developing the War of Shadow. Same letters, same words, but different meanings between the Lios and the Svart. So to understand an inscription, you'd need to know who wrote it.

I guess my first question is - to what end? Is there a story reason? Is there a mechanical reason? Are you driving FotN towards a more historical approach? Verisimilitude? My own view of FotN doesn't trend particularly historical, and languages would at best be a plot point - knowledge of the language would become a McGuffin. After it was acquired, it probably never appears again.

I like languages and dialects too, but it feels like not a part of the sagas at all to my knowledge. People just talk to each other, and it gets glossed over when folks really should be speaking other languages. Bear in mind, I doubt I have as much knowledge of the sagas as you or the Saga Thing folks, so be happy to be shown wrong, but I've never seen anything that indicates they had difficulty speaking with each other.

[dafelsheim]

Regarding how languages might be handled for Powers, I would generally be in agreement with Raleel - they would be magical and thus universal in communication unless specifically noted in the description.

As for general use of languages, the sheer number of dialects and the like that would be historically appropriate for 10th century Europe would be so staggering that actually implementing any sort of mechanical effects of even a fraction of them would be hard. I'm a partially-college-educated scholar of Indo-European linguistics (specifically Latin, but I've also delved in my free time beyond this.) I think if you were going to specify languages for Midgard, you might use the 10 Indo-European subgroups of languages for simplicity's sake:

- Albanian
- Anatolian
- Armenian
- Balto-Slavic
- Celtic
- Germanic
- Hellenic
- Indo-Iranian
- Italic
- Tocharian

Beyond Midgard, my gut instinct is to imagine the various denizens of the other Worlds as speaking languages specific to their races/divine families, rather than common languages for each World. For example, they might include: Aes, Van, Alf, Wyrm, Vaett, etc.

[Sandra Regina]

Having run D&D for ages where languages/communication are easy barriers to overcome, I'm actually looking forward to a situation where people can't necessarily understand each other. Of course, body language counts for a lot (taunting, to me, doesn't require you to know exactly what someone is saying, but facial expressions/body language as well as tone of voice can convey the gist and general meaning of a conversation).
The way I am thinking of running it is tying languages to Lore: Locales. Everyone will be fluent in their own language (of course), and be able to understand the basics of those lands that are nearby. If you have the Locale lore for a specific place, then you are fluent in that language too. (this isn't Realistic, but it works well enough). For the other Realms, etc, it completely 'depends'. Gods/Jotuns/higher powers can just communicate with whomever they wish to - and conceal communication too! Lesser beings of those Realms may be completely unintelligible or need the appropriate Lore to understand.
I hope that makes sense and works in practice. Broad enough to cover the Saga scope, but leaves room for hilarious/dangerous miscommunication!