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PostPosted: Sun Dec 15, 2013 8:08 pm 
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Joined: Thu Nov 21, 2013 10:19 pm
Posts: 22
I've been playing a couple practice games, of just combat, and I have a question.

When I create a Grizzled Warrior or a Zealot to go against my heroes I choose weapons for them.
Each weapons has some stats... DF, Pierce, Parry, etc
These can then be enhanced by Passive or Active powers.

But what about things like Wolves or Polar Bears, or the like, that have natural weapons.
I don't see any base stats for a Wolves Bite or a Polar Bear's claws.
Am I just missing something?

Thanks
Tom M
Essex Junction VT


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 16, 2013 9:58 am 
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Joined: Sun May 19, 2013 3:46 pm
Posts: 38
what you are looking for is page 129: Size based natural damage
it covers everything from kicks, claws, fangs, tentacles and violent tickles

basically size -3 with a minimum of 1


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 16, 2013 10:41 am 
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Joined: Thu Nov 21, 2013 10:19 pm
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Thanks, that makes sense now.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 16, 2013 2:38 pm 
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Joined: Thu Nov 21, 2013 10:19 pm
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You did so well answering that, I have another...

If an active power, like insulting parry, just says "+1 Parry" do I assume that means +1P parry?
Meaning it's a physical parry.
Or could it be Mental or Spiritual as well?


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 16, 2013 4:10 pm 
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Joined: Fri Sep 27, 2013 3:08 pm
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Parry and PF by default apply to Physical damage (They only apply to other types of damage if mentioned specifically, such as items that add +1 Mental PF... which is Mental only.). The only defense that can be used across the board would be Evade, which can be used to counter any damage type.

Quote:
On page 98: "Damage from Mental or Spiritual sources primarily uses Evade as Parry items; those Traits are very rare and will most likely come from magic items."

On page 113: "Parry bonus: These types of bonuses are added to a Defend action. They are Trait-specific; if the Trait is not specified, the default is Physical."
Also page 113: "Evade bonus: These types of bonuses apply against all Traits. Evade is always added to any Defend action."

I hope that helps. I also have a question along similar lines if someone can help me track down the ruling as well. What is done with damage that doesn't mention a specific type? Is non-descript damage Physical by default, or can it add to a type that's already present in the attack?

Example:
Quote:
Bone Snapper: Deal 4 P damage and ignore 8 Defence.

It is a spell action, but clearly designates that damage is Physical.
Quote:
Possess Opponent: Deal +2 damage and inflict the Possessed condition with a +1 Intensity on an opponent [Counter:S]

This description says nothing of the source of damage. So I would assume Physical if no other factors are present. However, if you also have a Passive Power such as "Angered Spirit" (which adds +1 S Damage bonus and Move +1 bonus when bloodied), could the non-descript damage match the specific type now present in the attack (since there is now a source of Spiritual damage)?

Likewise, Passive Powers such as Desperation (Your Attack actions gain a +2 Damage and +2 Pierce bonus if you are Bloodied), would that add Mental damage to mental attacks? Or even Mental Pierce as well on Mental attacks? (Or likewise with Spiritual)


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 16, 2013 6:22 pm 
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Posts: 77
Actually Possess Opponent is in the errata (S damage)
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=46

That's an interesting question about the trait bonus afforded by passives. I never really thought about that one since we started playing. We always played it as physical only, just from most descriptions it seems like it would be delivered by a physical blow (well bow too). But now it's got me thinking... I guess if someone received a weapon that deals M or S damage, then it would apply. Now I don't know, any vets can clear this up?


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 16, 2013 6:37 pm 
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Joined: Fri Sep 27, 2013 3:08 pm
Posts: 46
Ahh, perfect, you're right about Possession. Thank you.

I guess I would assume the same with Desperation, as the pierce mechanic also seems to suggest physical. But I could also see the argument made that this desperate frenzy simply amplifies your attacks... so a mental attack would be amplified in Mental damage.

I don't recall where, but iirc there's a spot in the CRB that talks about damage bonuses from Focus, and how the damage must be split amongst the present damage types (e.g. a 4P 2S damage attack with +2 Focus would become a 5P 3S damage attack). Would passives with undesignated damage work in a similar manner?

Edit: I understood Focus incorrectly. The dweller designates what it increases if there are multiple options.
Quote:
On Page 120: "If there is more than one Source (see page 100), then the Focus must be distributed among the Sources as the dweller wishes.


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 20, 2013 11:04 am 
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Joined: Thu Apr 25, 2013 10:39 am
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Heh, I was hoping I wouldn't end up in the same place Magic the Gathering was in the early 90's when the initial cards were a little too loose with the text. They later had it rigorously structured like a legal document to ensure nothing gets misinterpreted. This is all good feedback for us moving forward. So a clarification: Anything that doesn't have a Trait specified is Physical or boosts Physical. There may be specific exceptions with some inconsistent text that I would be happy to clarify on a case by case basis if someone surfaces a phrase that may break this mould. So if you find something that sounds like it should apply to another Trait or all Traits, call it out in the errata thread please.

As a general rule, Mental and Spiritual numbers will be HALF of the values presented for Physical. A spell that deals physical damage will typically hit for 4 or boost PF by 2, but for Spiritual and Mental you will see damage values of 2 and PF values of 1. Also pierce is going to affect Physical primarily, and the intent was to use different language for M & S: "ignore X defence" (I don't think that's 100% consistent). I'll have to re-check the infuse/craft rules to make sure that language is consistent. Also moving forward you probably won't see much (if any) Mental attacks that negate defence... and that's by design.

Thanks for bringing that up, it's a good question! :)

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